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  1. #1
    Kantai Analyst 211303's Avatar
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    DMM's announcement on other companies using the term "kanmusu"

    https://dmm-corp.com/press/press-release/23226

    Translation:

    We have noticed that the word "kanmusu" is used to refer to characters in game promotion/announcement from another company.

    The said game is not in any way related to our company and "Kantai Collection".

    Moreover, we believe that the word "kanmusu" was created to refer to the characters in "Kantai Collection", and is a very important element of "Kantai Collection".

    DMM Group has already trademarked the word "kanmusu" (ID 5682313, 5682314).



    Well, while the announcement hasn't specifically referred to any game, it is clearly a response to the word "kanmusu" appearing in the new PV of Azur Lane. DMM hasn't mentioned any actual measures they are going to take yet.


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  2. #2
    Rear-Admiral Impstar_Deuce's Avatar
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    Well, if DC and Marvel can trademark the word 'Superhero.'....




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  3. #3
    Rear-Admiral D Des's Avatar
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    @211303

    Because azur lane jap dev has offering their apology towards the problem not long after dmm acting like a dick......and now seems AL dev asking people opinion regarding what term they better use to call the girls.

    Quite humble of azur lane dev really.....while kancolle team by days seems to be worsening......


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  4. #4
    Kantai Analyst 211303's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by D Des View Post
    @211303

    Because azur lane jap dev has offering their apology towards the problem not long after dmm acting like a dick......and now seems AL dev asking people opinion regarding what term they better use to call the girls.

    Quite humble of azur lane dev really.....while kancolle team by days seems to be worsening......
    Let's be honest, the word "kanmusu" was trademarked by DMM back in 2014. It is entirely AL's fault for not checking the legal issue before releasing that PV. AL's dev did the right thing and apologize immediately, but DMM is merely protecting its own legal right.

    It's not about being a dick. It's protecting the benefit of the brand, the company, and the employee whose income relies on the KC brand. In fact, given that DMM releases this announcement as a warning first without actually taking legal action, DMM has already taken a few steps back.


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  5. #5
    Vice-Admiral Murrue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by D Des View Post
    @211303

    Because azur lane jap dev has offering their apology towards the problem not long after dmm acting like a dick......and now seems AL dev asking people opinion regarding what term they better use to call the girls.

    Quite humble of azur lane dev really.....while kancolle team by days seems to be worsening......
    So protecting your own property when you're in your rights is being a dick?.....



  6. #6
    Vice-Admiral DLRevan's Avatar
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    @D Des

    As pointed out, they trademarked this long ago. And in 2014, we didn't know that the idea of "fleet girls" was going to become something...less than unique. Its a perfectly normal practice, and if you created such a brand and didn't at least try and acquire some trademarks, you're creating a lot of leeway for companies less scrupulous than the ones associated with AL.

    The only thing "better" they could have done was to warn them only in private, and no doubt they have. But I feel this public notice is fine as well. They did not publicly indict AL. It was a good chance to make clear that they have the trademark to not just AL, but everyone else who might use it in media.

    And look at wording of it. It isn't even really accusatory. It simply reminds that they have the trademark, and that they are not associated with anyone else who may have used it accidentally. This is DMM protecting its rights and brand, nothing more that we are publicly privy to.

    If you don't defend the trademark, there's grounds that it can be invalidated. You can't have it both ways, trademark it and let others use it freely.


    Last edited by DLRevan; 06-03-2018 at 07:25 PM.
    Murakumo 17th June 2015
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  7. #7
    Rear-Admiral D Des's Avatar
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    @Murrue

    What's funny is....why now? There are other ripoff games too and no counter measure that is noteworthy until now.
    Sure I might be ignorant on the cases but I don;t really see the point of legalizing the term KANMUSU other than company competition taking it to kid level......giving off vibes they afraid of franchises and means they not ready for competition.


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  8. #8
    Vice-Admiral DLRevan's Avatar
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    @D Des Why now? That's easy. The "legitimate" ripoff games like warship girls never used the term "kanmusu" in official capacity, or at least nowhere I know, and presumably DMM too. The term is trademarked, not the idea. DMM had no reason to ever made a public statement before.

    As as for the non-legitimate ones, meaning ads, games, and media that pull KC assets, actually some of these have been taken down after legal action is taken, and probably more legal action is taken that you don't hear about. Because every measure isn't made public, and there are inevitably many cases outside of Japan, especially in mainland China

    One problem you have while looking at this is that you see this as an antagonistic move to 'fight' KC's competitors, or something like that. It is really, perfectly, normal to trademark something you believe is emblematic of your brand. This isn't just to prevent competitors from using it, its meant to prevent it being used to damage your existing brand, or unfairly taken advantage of.

    Imagine this. Lets say in 2014, DMM didn't trademark the name. And at the same time when still nobody associated "kanmusu" with anything but KC, a food chain starts promoting a line of seafood products using fictional characters, anthropomorphic ships like KC's, and applied the name "kanmusu" to it. Remember, at this point, many everyday Japanese already associate the term with KC, even if they don't play it themselves. Inevitably, some are going to think its associated with KC. Even players, some of who may not care about such details. That's bad enough, because they're likely profiting off not the term precisely, but rather KC as a popular game. Now what if the same product line suddenly had a food poisoning scandal? At best, the KC team now has to spend $$$ on marketing and PR to make sure everyone understands they have absolutely nothing to with it. And such things are usually never 100% successful.

    Or DMM can just trademark it. Nobody's using it anyway for anything else, and nobody challenged them for it. What a simple solution for probably a million possible things that could happen. It's not kid level. It's just common sense. And most of those scenarios have nothing do with competitor games, like my example.

    Anyway, the notion that people are afraid of competition and therefore trademark is silly. Disney is afraid of a competitor making a movie called Toy Story? Is Apple afraid of another company making a phone called the iPhone? Of course not. You trademark so you have legal rights when someone uses that term important to your brand in a way that can damage it. And you always must defend it, or you lose it.


    Last edited by DLRevan; 06-03-2018 at 10:36 PM.
    Murakumo 17th June 2015
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  9. #9
    Rear-Admiral D Des's Avatar
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    @DLRevan

    Now that you mentioned Disney, that's what I see in what dmm doing now - and I don;t wanna talk about how Disney copyright issues, you surely know it more than I do.
    And actually apple once sue Samsung for smartphone stuffs.....and we can see how things now - and if we still goes on about this matter we better change the title to franchise discussion~

    "Because every measure isn't made public"
    Why does it made to be public stuffs now if many measures was not?? Professionally this stuff should be solved between the companies and not to be leaked since its regarding reputation (dmm can juz give warn to AL company and have no need to make a fuss over trademark and legalized stuff)
    Trademark usually is never a problem UNTIL the owner decided to make a fuss over it......and followed suit by many voices fanning the flame to make things worse than it should be.

    Bottom line I'm not really favoring for either companies nor have any other stuff about it (heck wat am I anyway). Only I see that all this trademark fuss is....well??......like 2 kids arguing over who rule the playground refusing to play together and making up reasons. A small matters that made to be big, trying to stir up something.....

    Plus who will benefit from this? - AL will change its term and all other ripoff will juz wind up other fancy terms exclusively to their own not stopping other lookalike game from popping, then on the end of the day.....what does it changes?? What's the point of all this drama??


    Last edited by D Des; 06-03-2018 at 11:10 PM.
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  10. #10
    Vice-Admiral DLRevan's Avatar
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    @D Des If I have a main point, it's that you are creating the drama for yourself. There is no real problem here. This just means when people say the word kanmusu, it's to be associated with KC. So what's wrong with that? It's not pointless either, you form a brand out of such things...just as you piece two innocuous words "bat" and "mobile" together and you instantly bring to mind one of the most famous superheroes. And that's not even the word Batman, just one of his tools.

    I don't feel like you've bothered to even really read what I've said anyway. You're determined to paint them as some kind of bad guy for defending their rights. You even say the trademark is not a problem till the owner makes a fuss about it....hey wait I already told you you have to defend it or you lose it. Where you reading at all?

    By the way, copyright is not the same thing as trademark. And the iPhone cases are over patents. That is not the same thing as this, and not what I meant when I referred to the iPhone trademark. Though you seem to be confusing all of these different types of protections.

    The drama is created by you alone. DMM posted what amounts to a reminder. AL accepted it, and takes measure to use their own term which maybe one day will be emblematic of their own brand. What quarrel is there here, except the one you imagine in your head.

    In a nutshell, copyright and trademark is a big deal, but you think it isn't. While the responses by both parties is a minor affair, which you felt became a big deal.


    Last edited by DLRevan; 06-04-2018 at 01:01 PM.
    Murakumo 17th June 2015
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