Hello & Welcome to our community. Is this your first visit? Register
  • News & Announcements
      As a counter measurement to Ad spam, newly registered users are required to create a thread in the Introduction Forum before allowing to be able to reply and create threads.
      Please allow some time for posts to be approved. We thank you for your patience on this matter.
Bookmark Thread
Page 4 of 6 FirstFirst ... 23456 LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 60
  1. #31
    Admiral Ghoulvarine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    IGN
    Ari-kun
    Server
    パラオ泊地
    Posts
    6,612
    Rep
    67
    Mentioned
    876 Post(s)
    @goesto11 Yeah there are more factors going into costs as opposed to resource gathering so it is an overwhelming deficit. But I think increasing the daily/weekly rewards is a good start. I just can't bring myself to sortie X amount of times to get 400 fuel and 700 bauxite, which likely doesn't even pay for itself. A x3 multiplier will probably be decent. To simplify, if I'm just getting a net 30-40% of the rewards due to operational costs, it is more reasonable and would actually give me the incentive to do those quests in the first place and some of them require to be done in order to unlock other quests that provide other valuables like screws. With a 1200 fuel reward, gaining 480 fuel because it cost me 720 fuel is not too bad a trade. The values may vary but that's like running an extra expedition there.


    "Without love, without anger, without sorrow, breath is just a clock ticking"

    Started: 11/14/14 LSC Graduation: 7/7/16 First Kandex Completion: 5/21/17
    Remaining EOS: Sagiri My K2 List

  2. #32
    Marshal Admiral ofi123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    18,367
    Rep
    221
    Mentioned
    2646 Post(s)
    @goesto11

    True boss node do always drop for A+ ranks though, it's only for the phase 1 boss node which to be fair doesn't count if you consider how normal maps work. Plus new girls always drop in the true boss node, with normal nodes and phase 1 boss node drops being extra drop locations.

    As for fast+, it's definitely targeted for veterans or P2W players so they have an easier time like all F2P games for E4 farming. Newer players are likely to choose a lower difficulty, while for free playing veteran it's a combination of number of RE accumulated and luck of the ships RE were used on.



  3. #33
    Vice-Admiral DLRevan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    IGN
    DLRevan
    Server
    Kanoya Airfield
    Posts
    3,089
    Rep
    85
    Mentioned
    1023 Post(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by 211303 View Post
    The only maps I would say that are comparable are 2014 Summer E7, 2015 Summer E7, 2017 Summer E7 and 2018 Winter E7 p2 without ff.
    That does place this map among the most difficult, but arguably not the most difficult by far. Which is what I'm talking about. This map is not "special" to the point of being Summer 2015 before debuff...especially since we're making a comparison of this map before and after FF, another 'mitigation' mechanic. You recall we had no friggin' clue about the debuff until the devs saw how the whole community was floundering and started dropping hints on how to find the new mechanic.

    Quote Originally Posted by 211303 View Post
    Fall 2017 doesn't even belong in this conversation. That map is average at best.
    But had a very high focus on historicals, which is the special conditions I am talking about when I mentioned this map. The map was not difficult, even below average difficulty...only if you had everything they had asked you to prepare. But a complete PITA without. Granted it was unlikely for older players to lack the ships in question, but you could not come into this event with just the usual preparations and expect to clear everything on your usual difficulty.

    Actually I do ask that you look at it in context too. You actually explain it all yourself, even Summer 2015. Why do we demonize it? These events were hard for their time due to various factors, but in particular, before "mitigation" mechanics were given to us or discovered. That's why I singled out Summer 2015 in particular. Not only did it have a new mechanic that was mandatory for us to use...and we didn't know what the hell it was for half the event...you have all these other factors like lack of experience among the English community. lack of a built up meta around certain ships, and so on. We have all the tools we needed for the current event, more or less, and the clear rate is more sure, even if really difficult. As you say 7 people or so cleared it "normally", that is hardly the same in this event, and even after de-buffed, it was still difficult, for all the other reasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by 211303 View Post
    Again, this is not about the actual passing rate, as 2017 Summer obviously have way lower passing rate. What I am criticizing is that it is not rewarding player's effort put into the game. I am really just saying I prefer a 40% passing rate node that can be improved to 50% by players' effort over a 50% passing rate node that cannot be altered by the player's effort. I personally feels more satisfied overcoming the former than the latter. It's not about the actual outcome, but how I feel when I am tackling it.
    I already agreed with this, and this is also really my main issue....and I believe something both of us are concerned more with over whether this particular event really was designed around FFs, to be reasonably cleared only if you used it. Because they're not going away, and the future events will only get harder I'm sure, FFs will become a baseline requirement, if not in this event, then in future ones.

    Whether we agree if the map is difficult or not with FF, it definitely isn't with FF. One of the FFs even had 5~6 ships capable of oneshotting the biggest meatshields, while we ourselves can't fit that many in our escort. And the only other major problem, the Re-node, is un-counterable by any conventional tools that we can spend effort to prepare. Buy an expansion slot and a goddess, there's your solution. Hardly resounding, rewarding tactics, as you say.



    Quote Originally Posted by 211303 View Post
    This will become a way bigger problem soon when another wave of newbies come after watching the new anime.
    There's plenty of things certainly. Other than what you mention. BB specials for those who want to upgrade to Medium or higher...but only Nagato and Mutsu are available outside of events and they cost enormous resources in terms of medals and leveling to prepare. LBAS bombers are neither easy not cheap to craft, and several recent past events (though thankfully not this one) have made things very difficult for people tackling even Casual with newbie fleets but no bombers long range enough to reach the boss nodes. And historicals. Nowadays the key historicals are either always the very few same faces, which is getting boring, or event-only ships, which is always bad for newbies, and sometimes for vets as well if they're rare drops. I had many friends who didn't have Tashkent or Johnston in this event. There's a ton of other ships in-between who rarely get to step up, except maybe with token 1.1 mods or so. On the topic of newbies or casual players, there's a ton of problems, if we were to be honest.




    On a side note, I recall you mentioning that Nagato special triggers about 50% of the time at lvl 99. Was that what you encountered? Mine almost always triggered, and not just this event. Past events, plus regular sorties. I'd say 80~90% of the time. I basically expect to see it whenever I trigger the right formation conditions.


    Last edited by DLRevan; 06-29-2019 at 12:13 PM.
    Murakumo 17th June 2015
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Touch Fluffy Kumo


  4. #34
    Admiral goesto11's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Server
    Paramushir Anchorage
    Posts
    4,956
    Rep
    174
    Mentioned
    1649 Post(s)
    @Ghoulvarine: Don't get me wrong, I think the idea has merit, my point was just there are two sides to the equation and only focusing on one side may not change much in the end if costs keep spiraling up. Need to look at both. Still, sure bumping up some expedition returns, increasing quest rewards, etc. would be a good start.

    I'm not sure what, if anything, devs will do. My speculative guess is that maybe drop rates will be better next event. Will it be a large 7 map event with 3 or even 4 new ships to farm (and thus high resource burn)? No idea. I don't think a large event is a given. My guess is that the path of least resistance for devs is to adjust event(s) (or at least next event) rather than daily/weekly/etc. quest rewards & expedition returns. A lot depends upon core player base feedback (which isn't KC English players). No clue how this event is viewed outside of here, KC Wikia and reddit (not a big reddit fan, but did skim through some threads post event).

    -----
    @ofi123: Eh, I don't subscribe to the "true boss node" narrative. It's got a boss node symbol & comp (maybe not as hard as the second, but still) and a gauge = boss node. So for me it counts. If it's not a boss node (and thus no guaranteed drop), don't have a boss node symbol and/or a gauge to deplete. There are other nodes with 'bosses" that don't have a gauge and a boss node symbol = normal nodes.

    Quote Originally Posted by ofi123 View Post
    As for fast+, it's definitely targeted for veterans or P2W players so they have an easier time like all F2P games for E4 farming. Newer players are likely to choose a lower difficulty, while for free playing veteran it's a combination of number of RE accumulated and luck of the ships RE were used on.
    Well, I'm not the most hard core player, but I'd say I'm quasi-hard core if not "lower-end hard core" - definitely not casual. Also not free to play either after buying over 200 slots and around a dozen rings. Frankly, I never looked at KC as an entirely free to play game anyway. At the least, you'll want to buy slots to build a fleet. Still, limits. I may buy more slots & rings, but that's really it. So I'm not sure where I fit exactly into the above categories.

    To me, buying more RE for a bunch of fast+ fleets (or Goddess equipped fleets) gets into P2W. Understand the business motive for devs to accommodate the "whales" and such, but my point is that I don't think one can just go "Fast+ was fine for farming E-4" and end the analysis there. Start with decent farming for all, and then if you want to give a bit of an easier time for P2W type players, fine.


    Thanks to Arkayda for the signature.


  5. #35
    Marshal Admiral ofi123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    18,367
    Rep
    221
    Mentioned
    2646 Post(s)
    @goesto11

    Since it was farming in casual/easy, getting ships from E-1 to E-4 to form a fast+ fleet was easily possible for me. I believe the number of free RE given out through events and quests is well over 20, maybe even over 30. This number is quite doable considering the number of ships that are used for E-1 to E-4, unless one happen to have full E-5 RE fleet with a few more that wasn't used in the event and not able to fit the E-4 fast+ CTF fleet.

    So for F2P veterans it's not impossible, if anything is pretty doable unless just managed to RE over a combined fleet worth of ships (or even 2) that can't be used there.


    Last edited by ofi123; 06-30-2019 at 03:01 AM.

  6. #36
    Admiral goesto11's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Server
    Paramushir Anchorage
    Posts
    4,956
    Rep
    174
    Mentioned
    1649 Post(s)
    @ofi123: There's been somewhere between 20-30 RE I'd say, but you keep in mind that you get tags when you sortie on a map. So, I'm very limited in who I can sortie prior to clear. Also, it's wasteful to just put an RE on a ship to farm for one particular map for one particular event. Maybe there's some overlap for events, but not always 100%. Can't do that over multiple events. Same is true for RE -> Goddess to have a decent pass rate. Still think that devs should plan farming without the gimmicks first, then decide whether they want to put in a little bonus for those who don't mind buying extra RE.

    As for free to play for veterans, I have to ask what you mean by "free to play", because sure seems to me that the days of 100 sloters clearing on Hard or even Medium are gone. Too many historic ships bonuses, increased fleet locking, etc. If you're buying slots (which again, I think is fine), I don't think that = free to play.


    Last edited by goesto11; 06-30-2019 at 03:49 AM. Reason: additon
    Thanks to Arkayda for the signature.


  7. #37
    Marshal Admiral ofi123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    18,367
    Rep
    221
    Mentioned
    2646 Post(s)
    @goesto11

    The reason I include E-4 in the E-1 to E-4 is that you can sortie the STF prior to lock them in, so only E-5 fleet is excluded.
    As for the RE count, I just did a count. From the wiki (not wikia), 42 in total. 15 from quests, 27 from events. 8 from Summer 15 alone, with the exception of Winter 16 all other event have at least 1 RE. So that's 3 combined plus a single fleets worth. After excluding E-5 that's up to 30 ships to pick from for E-4 fast+.

    As for F2P, I do believe there are players running F2P play through, either main or sub account.



  8. #38
    Admiral goesto11's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Server
    Paramushir Anchorage
    Posts
    4,956
    Rep
    174
    Mentioned
    1649 Post(s)
    @ofi123: I get what you mean, but IMO it's still too much of an "in a vacuum" type analysis to simply state x amount of RE via rewards = y amount to lock for STF on one map for one event. That's not a great trend going forward. There's some overlap with RE ships, but not enough for me on E-4 and I already used 11 or 12 this event. Maybe 4 or so were unnecessary (e.g. put one on Akagi K2 before realized go with Saratoga for E-5, but good CV so not a bad thing given OP 12cm Rockets K2 AACI). Not all though, albeit part of that was because I was saving up RE for such a situation. I was able to avoid using RE+Goddess for Summer 2017 (pretty sure right event) which helped a lot here.

    Point is can't just look at one event/situation in isolation. Also, you're going back to Summer 2015. I didn't hard clear that (or a couple other events), so I don't have all the RE possible. Furthermore, What about all the players who started after Summer 2015? That's 8 less RE alone. Could start say around Winter 2016 and be a 3+ year veteran of the game. There are players who spent a lot of time ramping up in just 2 years for Hard clear capability. Welp, down 8+ RE just from Summer 2015 alone. Not sure what else to say other than what I said earlier. Plan farming without Fast+ gimmick, and then if you want to give those with a lot of RE (or willing to buy more) a little bit of benefit for farming with Fast+ fleet. That's fine, but avoid penalizing the rest unduly.

    As for free to play players, still not sure what you mean. I take that literally = no money spent on the game (so "100 sloters"). Sure, there are probably some "vet" 100 sloters (not the same thing as new players trying out the game). Still, are they doing all Hard clear these days (or even Medium clears where fleet locking applies)? Can probably get on Easy & Casual (for sure), but need big fleet for historic bonuses, fleet locking, etc. these days. Game's a lot different than back in say 2015.


    Last edited by goesto11; 06-30-2019 at 05:07 AM.
    Thanks to Arkayda for the signature.


  9. #39
    Marshal Admiral ofi123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    18,367
    Rep
    221
    Mentioned
    2646 Post(s)
    @goesto11

    Thing is, I was saying from the start that fast+ easy/casual farming was for veterans as an alternative option. Previously it was ONLY clear phase 1, do 3-5 times phase 2 boss battles and reset. No other way. E3 this time is like that.
    4-5 is quite similar to this. You can skip a node with fast+ but lose DA on sanshiki CA(V)s and some carrier power. And given the time between 4-5 have a fast+ route to this event having a farming route that players have almost no incentive to use other than in casual which allows for all ships except E-5's, I would say it's the progression from there. I wouldn't be surprised to see fast+ for actual clearing in 1-2 years.

    Back to the discussion of option. How many of these was already farming easy/causal before clearing in hard? It's not like it's any more feasible trying the fast+ in hard than STF given the difficulty spike in both boss node and sub nodes so it's pretty much for those farming first players. And for veterans in that group, it's literally how well equipped one is to skip mainly water CV demon. So basically a reward for either sticking to the game long enough or P2W to have cheaper farming route. I doubt veterans would have much difficulty in the normal CTF route in casual anyway. Do you seriously think the fast+ route would exist as a normal route to the final boss in an E-4 event map?

    Back to F2P. I seriously have no idea why you mention hard. The fast+ route at best could be used for chipping, but given the power pike I doubt even the top players of the server would use that route for chipping. It's literally a route meant for farming in casual and at best in easy, in which F2P veterans would easily do if they want Fletcher over 1 of their 100 ships since literally over 1/4 or even 1/3 of their fleet would have RE. If they go easy/casual for all maps, locking is no issue and they can have 1/3 of their fleet to pick from.


    Last edited by ofi123; 06-30-2019 at 06:22 AM.

  10. #40
    Lieutenant Ink20's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Server
    Paramushir
    Posts
    118
    Rep
    3
    Mentioned
    46 Post(s)
    @goesto11
    IMO, 100 slotters clearing event on hard is still possible if they have the right ships and the event isn't larger than this one.



 

 

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
All times are GMT. The time now is 11:41 PM.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.2
Copyright © 2019 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.
Resources saved on this page: MySQL 6.67%
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise v2.6.3 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Thread / Post Bookmarks provided by Thread / Post Bookmarking v1.1.1pl1 (Free) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd. Runs best on HiVelocity Hosting.
Live Threads provided by AJAX Threads (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Skin By: PurevB.com